When is it the right time to bring a player to the Major Leagues Reviewed by Momizat on . Let me start off by saying that I believe each person can handle situations differently. That is obvious, and in my time around major league baseball you realiz Let me start off by saying that I believe each person can handle situations differently. That is obvious, and in my time around major league baseball you realiz Rating:
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When is it the right time to bring a player to the Major Leagues

When is it the right time to bring a player to the Major Leagues

Let me start off by saying that I believe each person can handle situations differently. That is obvious, and in my time around major league baseball you realize that these men are just human beings. I have had jobs where a guy looked the part but mentally just could not handle success, failure or lacked drive. Major League baseball players have plenty of examples of guys that you work next to every day. The difference is not many of us are working next to instant millionaires (some at the age of 18)

Let me also note how much the game has changed. Before baseball free agency and arbitration and super two’s many players were challenged at the next level…some ready some not…some hall of famers and some busts.

Let’s take a look:

Robin Yount- Brewers starting SS at 18 years old. He was drafted in the 3rd round in 1973 out of high school and made his big league debut after just 64 games in Low A ball. He made the Brewers opening day roster and hit .250 as a 18 year old (he turned 19 in mid September) He was a very good player until the age of 24, at which point he became a star.

George Brett- 20 years old to start the 1974 season (had cup of coffee in 73) batted .282 with 2 home runs. He really emerged as a force in the major leagues in just his 2nd season.

Jeff Francouer- Called up from AA as a 21 year old and had a very good 1st season batting .300 with 14 home runs and looked to be an emerging star. He drove in 100 runs each of the next 2 seasons but has really bottomed out since then.

Jason Heyward- One of the great stories in all of baseball. He turns 21 in April was drafted in 2007 and is the starting RF for the Atlanta Braves and currently hitting .276 with 8 home runs in 105 at bats with 27 k’s and 22 walks.He has been described as a kid that is mentally beyond his years.

I realize that I could just start listing 100′s of players that went either way…But, i will leave that up to you…

So, here is the question when is it to soon? What if you heard the Royals had called up Mike Moustakas to play in the big leagues. I know they would have to remove a player to make room for him…But, what if this were to happen…what would you say?

Mentally he is a tough son of a gun…He had the great incident at Burlington where he literally put his arm up against a tough player with a poor demeanor for challenging a coach who had asked him to bunt. Moose was the youngest guy on this team and people still talk about this move. The player he went after had been a pain in the butt for some time and after the incident I heard even that player followed Moose around like he was George Washington crossing the Delaware. This is a kid that was born to play baseball as he grew uo in the baseball rich valley of Southern California and went to one of the most decorated schools in the country. Chatsworth high school. He grew up dominating the older kids in the neighborhood like the Cassel brothers who were all good friends.

I have gotten to know a rival high school coach of Moose recently. To me, it sounds like the stories about Moose in high school are almost like hearing stories about Big Foot. The Chatsworth high school coach batted Moose leadoff to get him more at bats. He crushed 800 foot homers to CF and ate fastballs for breakfast, curveballs for lunch, and sliders for dinner. You could not beat him and now he is a Royal,

Last season he struggled mightily in the pitching dominated Carolina league but this season he has been a monster at AA Northwest Arkansas. He has 7 home runs in 107 at bats with 15 k;’s, 13 bb’s and is batting .365 with a .705 slug.

He is 21 years old and will be 22 in September….The Royals would be bringing a guy up that would instantly ignite a fan base and receive national talk (from National Baseball people…I am not saying he will be featured on Late Night or Good Morning America) it would show the fans that there is a light at the end of the tunnel if he succeeds. But, what if he doesn’t and you ruin him.

I am a big believer in there is no reward without risk…If a guy can mentally handle a situation and the scouts believe he can handle the bat than let’s do this. If he hits .270 with 15 home runs the rest of the way  that is great but he is a very important piece to the process puzzle. Soon, Montgomery, Lamb, Hosmer will be here. All 3 have shown advanced skills beyond their age. All 3 have big time potential. Myers, Arguellas, and Crow all do too but they are not quite there yet…I believe the other 3 are.

Now before you start getting into contract status and accelerating his big league time towards free agency I want you to take a step back. Yes, I realize economics are part of the game but would we not be contradicting ourselves about what we throw out at the Glass family if we said he should not come up for those reasons.

I look forward to your thoughts

other players that came up very early good and bad

Shawon Dunston, Darryl Strawberry, gary Sheffield, Al Chambers, Shawn Abner, Brad Komminsk, Sammy Khalifa

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About The Author

Greg Schaum

Grew up on the streets of Overland Park...played my high school ball at Shawnee Mission North before playing college ball in Riverside, CA. I graduated from an original Big 8 school and love this great city. My favorite player as a kid was Frank Tanana and I thought U.L Washington was a cool MOFO

Number of Entries : 797

Comments (74)

  • Deep Dixie Blue

    Sosasoser said:
    “the thing to do is not just bring up Moustakas. Kila and Gordon should be coming up right with him. Put all three in the lineup for the rest of the year and just announce that you’re sticking with them whatever happens. If that means veterans don’t get as much playing time or get released, well it’s about time.”

    Well said. I have been clamoring for something like this since early in spring training. Let’s start evaluating some of these guys at the ML level right now, so we know what we have going into this next offseason and so these guys are ready to start competing for a pennant next spring.

    And I think very soon we will be adding the name of Derrick Robinson to the discussion. Check out the podcast on 810 of Rusty Kuntz talking about DRob (towards the end).

    Greg, what can you tell us about Robinson’s defense? And while we’re on it, Jarod Dyson as well. I’d like to see one of these guys patrolling CF in Kaufmann before the end of this season. KC has a history of stellar defensive CF’s (Amos Otis, Willie Wilson, Brian McRae, Carlos Beltran) but not one in a long time and I don’t think its a coincidence that their teams were winners.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Jeff

    I did not take it that way at all…I will be fine and I appreciate the convern…good things to come but can’t talk about it just yet

  • Jeff S

    Greg,

    I only asked about you selling ads at 610 because I hope you still have a job to buy food for the wife and kid. I apologize if you thought I was taking a shot at you or your credibility. I would imagine that there are several things in the works that may or may not happen. Thanks for all you do.

    I sure wish we had traded Duffy to the Rockies. Also, did you get a new job or are you hoping the site with ads and such will take care of income?

  • Sosasoser

    Greg, don’t worry about what some people say about you personally. You have no control over it, so just do your thing and run your site how you see fit. You’re doing good work here and you know that. Some people aren’t going to appreciate it because you can’t make everyone happy. Fortunately, there are many great Royals blogs out there, so there really is something for everyone.

    Personally, I don’t like being teased like this. However, you’ve gotten the fandom abuzz about something besides how awful the team or one of the players is. That’s rare these last few years, and it is appreciated.

    Back on topic, I still don’t like the idea of calling Moose up right now. He’ll be just as good after a little time in AAA. However, if they are going to do something like this, the thing to do is not just bring up Moustakas. Kila and Gordon should be coming up right with him. Put all three in the lineup for the rest of the year and just announce that you’re sticking with them whatever happens. If that means veterans don’t get as much playing time or get released, well it’s about time.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    thanks happie this is what i wrote to some people after a nice post at royalsreview.com

    by Juancho:
    The Royals’ biggest hole on the field is middle infield. My guess is the move is Moustakis directly to the Royals to play second base.

    As for Greg Schaum, seems to me that he can post his news briefs any way he wants. Nobody’s being forced to read them.

    What pretty clearly happened is 1) some source gave Greg a hot story 2) said source told him you can’t run with it now, for whatever reason 3) Greg doesn’t have independent confirmation of the story, anyway 4) therefore Greg gave away as much of the story as he could without implicating his source or influencing the outcome.

    POD WILL EXPLOD!!!!1!!

    by Juancho on May 19, 2010 4:08 AM EDT reply actions

    by me:
    Juancho thank you That is exactly what happened…I appreciate you saying that…a lot of people do not understand how these things develop…If it does not happen and I announce it is then I am wrong…I only said i am hearing a big time prospect could be moving up…If people followed my entire twitter timeline they would have a better idea of how this went down.
    I know it has been discussed and I would not have said anything otherwise, my contact is golden and would not put me in a position to fail…but, other things happen.
    Last year I almost announced we were getting Omar Quintanilla from the Rockies…but then the Royals grabbed Betancourt…I would have been wrong *i found out later the Rockies insisted on Danny Duffy)
    In this business you are only as good as your last story…but i guarantee my report card is solid….
    I noticed on scout (a place I will not write on anymore for various reasons) they keep going back to me missing on the Butler trade…well, the fact is that this discussion to Seattle happened and almost came into fruition but at the end of the day he stayed…Seattle was not the only place he almost went
    The Gutierrez trade, Hochevar not making the rotation, the Duffy story are a few that I did break (hat tip to facebook on Goot but I knew it was close and I found out who the player to KC were) I knew about Duffy quite some time b4 it was announced but i allowed it to play out the right way…I made a deal since i was the only one that knew and that unfortunately someone decided to let more people know…but, i was given a heads up and beat that story b4 others did

    I am not trying to pat myself on the back but maybe enlighten a few of the people that we hear a lot of crap stories…but we trust our solid sources and we dive in and try to confirm before we announce…in this case, I simply tweeteed what I heard but could not commit until I got a second source (which is ideal) it is not that I do not trust the first source, because I do –but even that source said that it is being discussed but not sure when/how and they also knew other things needed to happen

    I appreciate everyone here for having my back and I do understand I can not please everyone..thanks again…we are brothers in our fandom of a team that has not been good t

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Great comment Sergio

    Greinke was not involved in that trade…and if memory serves it was just Young for Gobble…But, maybe someone can correct us…I know when Beltran was being shopped his name came up with the Rangers…But, I do not remember the exact deal

  • happiocupcakeo

    Greg, don’t take some of these folks seriously. You do a great job of passing on what you hear. I love the site and appreciate this discussion. There are 67 comments on this topic, and I haven’t read every one of them, but I don’t know that you gave your 2 cents on this topic. What do you think Greg, should the Royals bring up Moose?

  • SergioNunez.400

    I’ve been a faithful follower of this site for almost a month now, and love the banter. To be a diehard Royals fan you must be a diehard Royals minor league fan! I’m not keen on promoting AA hitting talent too quickly. Moose has shined against “high upside, low experience” types for a month now, but I’d really like to see him take a few hacks against the AAA+ veterans who are crafty enough to make a living outside of the strikezone (he’s not a terribly patient hitter, right?). If he proves himself, so be it. But, I’m not for starting the clock on a kid who hasn’t seen a steady diet of breaking balls yet. Also, I get the feeling that many folks would be willing to trade Callaspo for a bag of chips! This poor guy is a fine hitter, and at least even, probably better than Moose at third. One final point that should be of interest to the Royals. When an org. risks bringing a prospect up too early, they are jeopardizing his trade value. Nobodys talking about trading Moustakus, but good organizations don’t expose their prospects until they’re relatively proven. They can do this because they’re usually solid teams, but this also allows them to entice other teams (often, the Royals) with trade material. If I remember correctly, there was talk of a trade between the Rangers and Royals a few years back. Rangers would send Micheal Young, and Hank Blalock (it hadn’t clicked yet for him) to the Royals for Carlos Beltran, and either Greinke, or “supertalented can’t-miss prospect” Jimmy Gobble. Instead of taking this outstanding trade, we wound up with “can’t miss prospect John Buck” and others.. I’ll try to be more concise in future comments.

  • Randa16

    I think the players and owners know about the contract part of it but Atlanta is not going to compete but they brought Hayward up. I dont blame moving Gordon up to him being a flop I think you either have it or not. I dont like keeping a player in the minors forever cause there is still going to be an adjustment to MLB no matter how good they are in the minors. If I were Dayton I would have Moose in Omaha at the break and if he shows he can handle that I would have him on the club next year.

  • NYRoyal

    After 25 AA games, Moustakas has nothing left to prove in the minors? Wow. Hell he hasn’t even faced many Texas League pitchers twice yet. Let’s see what happens when they adjust to him, and then let’s see how he adjusts to that. What a kid does in 25 AA games doesn’t prove anything. It’s a great sign, but he’s sure as hell got more to prove. Let him finish the season in NWA. Then start him next year in AAA. If he’s hitting well in Omaha in late May of next year, then call him up and the Royals will have control of him through 2017. Rushing him makes no sense.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Nope…my last day is tomorrow…but, honestly..what is going on air has nothing to do with me…

  • gail g.

    HE HAS NOTHING LEFT TO PROVE – HE WAS DRAFTED AS A POWER HITTER -8 HOMERUNS IN 3 WEEKS, NOT TO MENTION THE RBI’S, AND THAT HE’S HITTING OPPOSITE FIELD HRS, HITTING IN THE GAPS, EXTRA BASE HITS, ETC. I THINK THAT QUALIFIES AS A POWER HITTER, what the hell would he do in AAA, get bored and regress? He’s met the challenge so bring his Greek ass up!

  • Ryan

    I don’t know if anyone has brought this up, but of course Yost would want Moose up this year. Yost doesn’t have a contract that goes past this season. So, if Yost would want Moose up (and maybe he doesn’t), it would be his own self-interest and not the Royals. Service time matters, the 2010 Royals don’t.

  • Jeff S.

    Greg,

    I thought you still worked their selling ads or something…

  • NYRoyal

    As Max said, the service time issue isn’t about saving Glass or the Royals money. It is about choosing which six years (or perhaps 6 1/2 years) the Royals have control over Moustakas. If the Royals called him up now and he stuck with the the team, he’d likely be under team control through the 2016 season. If the Royals called him up in late May 2011, he’d likely be under team control through the 2017 season. So which would you rather have:

    2010-2016
    or
    2011-2017

    As the 2010 season is a complete loss and the Royals won’t be contending, what good does it do to have one of his service years burnt up now? Why trade 2017 (when the Royals might actually be contending) for 2010 (when the Royals definitely won’t be contending)? So we fans can feel a little more excited? So the Royals might win one additional game (net)? That’s pretty short-sighted, at best.

    And why should we feel confident that this 21-year-old is ready? Typically only very, very special talents are MLB-ready at age 21. Is Moose a future HOFer? Does less than two very good months of hitting in the Texas League prove he’s ready? What about the rest of his performance record? Or is it just about tools? Do you promote based solely on tools and ignore everything else? It sure seems like the Dayton Moore front office looks only at tools, but I don’t think that’s very wise.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    I want to remind everyone that this all started with a simple tweet that I said I am hearing a prospect could move up…we are really wanting to hang onto something here. I do not take back what I said but after all of this I do not know if it was really worth it. Where in my track record have I ever just lied to get attention.
    Also, have you heard me on 610 today…no, not once..why? I do not work for 610 anymore…they can do with the story what they want it has nothing to do with me

  • Jim

    Greg,

    I’m not saying this is true, and I wouldn’t put it past the royals to do something to sell more tickets, but I see this as some absolute BS.

    Every since this post, 610 has been pimping this hype like crazy. I just can’t buy this because Kila came up and saw 4 AB’s. Most would agree that Kila is better to bring up and help the team this year rather than bringing up a top prospect. Is this all just some story for your station that happens to be the royals’ radio home to bring in listeners?

    Like I said, 610 has gone crazy over this post. I don’t know if your website has become the “hype man” for your station, but how exactly will he fit into the lineup? Our team obviously couldn’t find room for Kila. How in the heck will they find room for Moose given they wouldn’t give Jose’s AB’s to Kila?

  • Wayne Hawkins

    Perhaps Maier is swapped for Gordon and Pods moves to center. Just a thought.

  • Brian

    Just hacking on you, Schaum! You do good work, but sound condescending sometimes. No biggie. But no promotion today either…..

  • Pat

    It’s not rushing a prospect if he’s ready. I would hope though, that he spends more time in the minors working on pitch recognition. Then up to AAA at some point, and maybe some time with the big club later this year.

    That being said, if he’s still putting up a .375/.457/.729 line end of June, beginning of July, I would say then he’s probably forced the Royals hand.

  • DornCounty

    My thoughts:

    Let Moose rake in AA for the rest of the season, have some fun in the playoffs. Bring him to ST in 11….. Send him down to AAA to start 11… If he dominated call him up sometime after the all star break. No reason to waste a year of service time on this team, plus you give him a nice bonding, playoff experience with his future teamates.. if he is leader material that is the sort of thing that would be invaluable if at some point the Royals actually do make a playoff run. I would rather have a year of Moose in 2017 than 2010.

  • kief

    SERVICE TIME? this is not walmart, and players are not like canned goods. If he’s ready, bring him up. Don’t shelve him till its more profitable to promote him. I realize that MLB is big business…..but GEEZ, don’t you think you can damage a player (or at least his attitude) by playing games with service time and instead of playing him at the level that he is ready for? That extra year of team control may not be worth anything if he doesn;t last that long!

  • @bkmhoxx (Aman Reaka)

    It all depends on when they see Moustakas hitting his prime. Maybe he will need a year and a half to put up huge numbers (kinda like Butler took a couple years)? Maybe the Royals have a peak window of 2012-2016 in which this is all mapped out? And THEN, if he has developed accordingly, they can try to sign a few of these guys to bigger/longer contracts. There is a master plan, whether the fans know it or like it or not. If they had Moustakas tentatively scheduled to come up at seasons end and he is doing what he is doing right now, then they alter the timetable, have him improve while on the job, improve the team and improve the fans sense of hope. Its easy to look back and say “We shoulda left Greinke in the minors a couple more years, because we arent winning with him and now his clock is running”. Ya gotta do whats right some of the time. I will listen to the “small market team” card on occasion, but not ALL the time. If thats the card we are going to play, then why isnt Butler still in AAA? :)

  • Max

    NYRoyal nails it here:

    http://www.royalsreview.com/2010/5/18/1477338/great-article-by-schaum-on-calling#comments

    “And the real service time issue is that we really shouldn’t want Moustakas’s six years of team control to include this horrible lost season. Would you rather have him on the team in 2010 or 2016? Which of those seasons are the Royals more likely to make good use of Moustakas?”

  • Amos Otis Fan

    Greg, do you think Gordon was moved to LF because they were already planning this?

  • @bkmhoxx (Aman Reaka)

    BABIP is a good statistic to use as a tool. Perfect, so his hard hit balls were turning into outs. Thats exactly what I mean. A large part of his struggles were happening WHILE he was making good solid contact. Thats exactly why statistics are just a tool.

  • Pat Cremin

    I saw Moose play in Tulsa last week. Very quick wrists, anda better fielder than he had been reputed to be. I also didn’t observe the lower body thickness as anything extraordinary. If he keeps it up through June, then bring him up and give him a shot while he is hot–BUT DON’T BRING HIM UP AND SIT HIM LIKE HUBER AND KILA.

  • jason

    if moose is still raking in july i would consider it. to small a sample size right now i think. id prefer to save all their service time and have them all come up together. like at the start of the 2011 season.

  • Max

    “A lot of stat nerds completely miss on a situation like this. How do you know that a large chunk of his outs were not hard hit balls? ”

    Stat nerds actually do account for this in BABIP (which was low in 2009 suggesting many of Moose’s hard hit balls were turning into outs).

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Great post Ahman….well thought out and a ton of good stuff here

  • bkmhoxx (Aman Reaka)

    Normally I am not a fan of rushing kids to the bigs BUT if you see a kid daily and dont have a failed history of rushing prospects (see Mets), and your scouts/coaches/evaluators see a kid as a leader and one that can take failure or a bad day/week and not get down on themselves or get flustered, and the kid shows that he wants more and will work to have more and to be great, then it technically is not “rushing”. Just because he hasnt proven himself at AAA doesnt mean that he isnt ready. The Royals evaluators have seen this kid go through a long stretch of struggles (last year) and he overcame and was absolutely mashing at the end of last year. His batting avg. struggled but he still hit 16 HR in a tough league and he BETTERED his doubles total by 7. A lot of stat nerds completely miss on a situation like this. How do you know that a large chunk of his outs were not hard hit balls? His strike out total only went up by 4. His walks were down by 11 and im sure he was pressing to raise his average which results in a lot more swings and less walks. Moustakas is always going to strike out a fair share but I can say that this kid is an excellent hitter that can mash with anyone. His hits remind me of a Manny Ramirez/Billy Butler mix (except he can play defense). Dont read so much into an empty stat like batting average. It means very little. Was he hitting the ball hard when he made outs? That is much more important and by the way he finished last year, I would say he was hitting the ball very hard but only the scouts and organization saw all of his at bats and know for sure.
    His bat is ready. His numbers probably arent going to be anything amazing. Its likely that he wont be Jason Heyward. But his bat is ready. Learning on-the-job isnt a bad thing for a kid that can handle it. Only the organization knows if Moustakas is one of those rare few that can handle failure and respond positively. You cant read his make-up, leadership, attitude and desire from a stat line.

    My main concern will be his defense. Im quite sure that his defense is NOT ready yet. If he can be placed in a DH situation 1/2 of the time, then he can learn more from the big-league coaches and players about his defense and improve while on the job and take infield with the big league coaches on a daily basis. He may be fine on defense, again something that only the scouts can tell you. His 24 errors last year concern me more than anything but if he was pressing mentally to fill up that batting average, then he could have been making his defense suffer.

    A LOT of top prospects never see AAA. The good ones usually dont. Sometimes the jump from AA to MLB fails, but a lot of AAA to MLB fails just the same. The Royals need to be freshened up, for the teams sake and for the fans sake. This move would not shock me in the least and I thought it might happen sooner than later as soon as they moved Gordon to LF. Im not saying its a failsafe move to make, but I DO think Moose is ready to give it a go.

  • Ryan S

    I wouldnt do it now, but in a couple months i hes stil hitting well and we traded guillen or Bert id consider it… Yesterday Joel had a long interview with yost on the pregame and he said he has seen a lot of the AA guys and spoke VERY highly of them for what thats worth

  • Brent

    Are we all right in thinking that it may be Moustakas getting the call to the big show already? I hate the idea of moving any of those AA kids to fast, but if it’s anyone it would seem that Monty has been just as dominant as Moose. Any chance Monty catches a start or two this year in the bigs?

  • Sosasoser

    It’s way too soon to bring up Moose. Such a move would reek of desperation on Moore’s part to show Glass that he can do something right. Moose might be ready both physically and mentally. It doesn’t matter. At least give the kid 100 at-bats in AAA. Ir the Royals want offense this year, they should be releasing Guillen and calling up Kila. That, and releasing Ankiel or Pods and getting Gordon back up.

    It’s stupid to take unnecessary risks with a top prospect. While I agree with Greg that there is no reward without the risk, the same reward will still be there for the team after Moustakas proves he can hit in AAA.

  • Wayland

    Greg, when can we expect to hear more about this?

  • keith

    “By the way, it really gets old hearing KC fans constantly cling to Gordon’s failures as the reason you NEVER EVER promote prospects ahead a level. There have been many, many, many prospects throughout the last 20 years or so that have turned in tremendous careers despite not playing in AAA, skipping AA, etc.

    Odds are Gordon would have turned out the exact same way if he had a run in AAA before going to the majors.”

    This is an outstanding post sir. I absofreakinlutely agree. I’d be surprised if Moustakas was up this early, sure. But the idea of rushing a guy I think is waaaaaaaaaaaaaay overblown. Unless there is something seriously wrong, they will figure it out one way or another.

  • jacob hurley

    Yah I’m ready to move an OF or two and get Gordon playing LF already, also. He was 5th on the big league roster in OBP for his brief stint..

    Pods and DeJesus have value right now, and at least one of them can go. Ankiel will need time to show other teams he’s worth a discussion still.. unfortunately.

    Dont think it will happen, and never would have imagined at the beginning of the season, Moose at 3B and Gordo in LF for the ’10 Royals.. Move Guillen and throw Kila into the mix too! .. although I dunno where callaspo goes, I would think Moose would have to man 3B daily if he’s up. I do love me some alberto though. Plus, we’ll have a couple other ‘specs in the system after those trades.

    GiddyUp

  • Max

    “Heyward DOMINATED every level? He had an 870 OPS in A ball, an 880 OPS in High A”

    Those A ball leagues (Sally and Carolina) are big time pitcher’s leagues. Posting a near .900 OPS as a teenager is about as dominant as you can get.

  • Deep Dixie Blue

    I imagine DM is getting all kinds of pressure from ownership to show something. This 8-10 year process crap wouldn’t fly with me if I was Glass. The minor league talent is impressive, but the ML team is going backwards. Now that Hillman is gone, its put up or shut up time for DM.

  • Beau

    Made –

    Gives him (Moose) some more time to continue to put up numbers in AA. Hopefully gives DM sometime to get the best deal he can pre-deadline for Guillen/Collaspo et al if it is possible. Also gives Yost some time to settle in with the current bunch to evaluate first hand. Just a thought.

  • Brian

    By the way, it really gets old hearing KC fans constantly cling to Gordon’s failures as the reason you NEVER EVER promote prospects ahead a level. There have been many, many, many prospects throughout the last 20 years or so that have turned in tremendous careers despite not playing in AAA, skipping AA, etc.

    Odds are Gordon would have turned out the exact same way if he had a run in AAA before going to the majors.

  • kief

    Let me be GM for a day and i would go ahead and bring up both Moose and Gordon. The shared experience of not being the only call up takes a little bit of pressure off of each of them (i am guessing both will get called up sometime this year anyway-why not together). Get rid of Akiel and Guillen however you can.
    By calling up both at once you double the excitement, and decrease the risk. With Gordon in the mix you know you will get at least one serviceable component for the team. But you have the upside of both doing well. If one struggles, the success of the other might distract some of the negative focus. Just a thought.

  • Brian

    Heyward DOMINATED every level? He had an 870 OPS in A ball, an 880 OPS in High A, and a dominant 160 AB stretch in AA with an OPS of 1.057 (below Moustakas’ current run in AA) before 3 games in AAA. POOF, he’s in the majors.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Made…

    I agree with you on Gordon….I have not moved on but I don’t speak his name in the same breath as Moustakas

  • Beau

    Is there a chance DM is getting pressure to get his guys to the big leagues sooner than later? I would think he needs a DM drafted farm system success story pretty bad right now.

  • happiocupcakeo

    My question, Greg, is this: Have you heard something that you need to tell us or is this just purely for discussion sake?

    Personally, I don’t feel like I am in a position to say without a shadow of a doubt that Moose should or should not be moved. I have never seen the guy play and even if I had I am no scout. But what I can do is look at different players who have been in similar situations and the situation the Royals were in under Allard Baird. Under Baird, our players rarely stopped in Omaha before being rushed to KC. That has to at least be a part of why this team is so bad now. But, as you pointed out, when a player is mentally and physically ready, then it doesn’t matter if he is in AA or AAA, if he is ready then he is ready. So the question becomes whether or not Moose is ready. If he is ready and they do it then the fans back off and we start to see this front office differently. But, if it fails and he bombs out and becomes like countless other guys who were rushed to the bigs, does it set the franchise back even further?

    Personally, I don’t think it is worth the risk but my plan for Moose includes this entire season at AA with a potential for September callup this year then ML invite to ST next year followed by Omaha.

    That being said, if the did call him up, I would be keeping a really close eye on the situation.

  • Clint kcscoliny

    When Yount, Brett, etc were playing arbitration clocks didn’t come in to play, I’m sure just as many prospects were ruined as made it (Texas HS pitcher can’t think of his name). I would love to see Moose on the big league club, I just don’t want to do it at the expense of the future. Wait til September if you want to really test his leadership and mental fortitude send him to Omaha at the end of June, a 17 game road trip will test him without starting his clock. If he makes it thru that and continues to rake will give him the call up.

  • dottehawk

    Would be dumb ass hell to bring him up now. Let him experience winning in AA, let him learn how to hit a curve ball and take a walk. Let him see the junk ballers in AAA for a couple months.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Good come back Max…Baseball is a different business…but, of course why I said what I said in the initial argument…should we (as Royals fans) even care about that anymore or do you want to see the best 25 guys up here

  • Max

    “Max—my question to you is this…How do you explain the success of Robin Yount then?

    Part of my argument is why Yount and not others….”

    Yount was a HOFer. HOFers tend to be pretty exceptional.

    I’m not saying Moose couldn’t handle it. He might. But its a big risk to take with little upside. The Royals are not contenders now. What’s the rush? What’s the upside to having him here right now?

    So far with Moose we have a guy who had one good season (albeit with a worrying OBA), one not very good season, and one good month. That’s a pretty inconsistent track record. In contrast, see Jason Heyward who pretty much DOMINATED every level he was at.

  • Made_Dad

    Beau – why do you have to wait until late June or July to make a move like this? Just curious.

    Also (Schaum) – what is this crazy consensus that people think Gordon MUST be a part of this team? Because he’s from Nebraska and was a top draft choice? Because he’s been prematurely labeled as the franchise? Because he flashed a few signs that he knows how to hit a home run and can take a baseball off the nose? I just don’t get it.

  • GoISU

    I say you call up Hosmer and Lamb and let them dominate AA and get a winning attitude and demand nothing else. Let them all come up through the system like the Twins did with there guys in the late 90′s.

  • Beau

    This would be a huge deal…Risk Versus Reward play. It is early in the year to pull this move off IMHO. This type of thing makes more sense to me in late June or early July. Agree that the Gordon moves makes more sense in this light long term. It will be interesting to see the cascading moves on the 40 and 25 man rosters. Could move or cut Guillen free – like Burrell and move Callaspo to DH/super utility player (Bloomquist?)as well on occasion if not traded.

    If he is mentally able to handle this than there is no time like the present. Have to trust the judgment of the development folks on this one. Shocked!

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    I would think it would have to be Guillen or Callaspo…If it is Guillen Moose could get his ab’s as a DH and get his innings at 3B (splitting time with Callaspo)

  • jacob hurley

    I would love to see a move like this. Our young guys are our future, and we should be catering to THEM. If it’s time for one of them, or more, to get some better competition.. then why wouldn’t we support their growth? All organizations operate differently with their levels of success.. and being a KC fan for the past 15 years, I think we all agree that this team will only be as good as their farm develops them. If there is one thing Dayton has proven to us, is that he does care about the draft and paying to get the needed young talent. You think Hosmer would be in our system without Dayton? doubt it.

    Lets try to get something out of our current big league “blockers”, kc making a splash before the deadline would be quite a site (for once), and get this party started!

    As for the ARB dates / Super Two stuff.. keep in mind, some of this may no longer exist after a new deal gets done. (But, being a KC fan, I do know this also plays a part in actually being able to KEEP A PLAYER AROUND.

    peace. I like the take, Greg, thanks -jake

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Max—my question to you is this…How do you explain the success of Robin Yount then?

    Part of my argument is why Yount and not others….

  • Max

    “but in Yount’s case those Brewers were not playing for anything and he is a legend”

    Also consider that was a different era. The Brewers could lock up Yount and pay for his salary.

    Service time matters. If Moose is any good, the Royals realistically have a six year window on him. To maximize his value to the Royals, they have to have him be ready to contribute from day one. Having him learn on the job is only going to waste valuable time as his service clock runs. I’d rather call him up a year too late than a year too early.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    U r probably right JT…In my argument I want all opinions…I think that if he came up and was succesful the Royals have a much better story to tell their fans going forward…but the BIG IF is if he fails…is that risk worth it

  • Max

    “Yeah it worked out with Beltran”

    Let’s not forget too that Beltran had a HUGE sophomore slump and showed immaturity when he refused a rehab assignment.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Kief

    Unfortunately I have not been able to see him this year…I am only going off what I have from scouts and other baseball people…ridiculously quick wrists and bat speed…crushing pitches and is a BP spectacle (not that this is why u should get called up) throw in the great character and the need for the Royals to show the fans something

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    I know most don’t believe the Royals would do this the right way…But Yost had been watching Moose for the better part of the last month…The Royals have some great people on their staff…what if those people clearly identified Moose as being a guy that can succeed sooner than others at the point in their careers he is at…these people btw were not emplyeed by the Royals when Gordon was coming up

  • Made_Dad

    Yes, please. And quickly. By 2012, it WILL be too late. We’re talking baseball players, not a chess protĂ©gĂ©. He WILL struggle – either right away or sometime after the shine wears off and AL pitching realizes how to work him. But he’s a freaking ballplayer and the naturals ones figure it out and go back to being very good at what they do. You could maybe make a case for pitching needing extra time, as even Grienke has to develop and re-develop pitches to stay ahead of the league hitters. But think about that very sentence – it’s the pitchers who have to tinker. True power hitters know how to hit at all levels and speeds. Very few are defensive specialists. So by leaving him in the minors to mature you’re waiting for what? If he’s hitting at AA, he’s ready.

    At worst – AT WORST – you option him back to Omaha and go back to having the same old broken wheel in KC. At best? You now have another piece to the puzzle moved up and gaining experience for when the others arrive.

    The reason this club continues to struggle is that they pin way to much future success on their damn draft picks and therefore put themselves in a position to sign bad re-treads for the big league team. Instead of evaluating quickly and keeping talent moving upward or outward, they play this old school way of waiting because they signed a veteran to a multi-year deal and want to honor that. (and the fans get honored back with really poor performances, season-lasting injuries and a pile of excuses.) Or even better, they accommodate mediocrity by making a 3rd baseman an outfielder. Guess what, Alex Gordon just might be a major league bust. It happens. Move on. And get these other guys moved up.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Great points Seth

    but in Yount’s case those Brewers were not playing for anything and he is a legend…I am sure we could discuss other examples
    I love ur post about rookies working out of the pen…as that is my belief to in a perfect world
    but comping Gordon to Moose is not fair based on my article…Moose is a different cat then Alex..I am not saying I am right and you are wrong…But, what if you hit and get another Beltran…

  • Seth

    I’m not in favor of jumping prospects, especially hitting prospects from AA to the majors. Yeah it worked out with Beltran, but I think it really hurt Gordon. You want your hitting prospects to see the breaking stuff in AAA that there isn’t much of in AA.

    I’d be OK with Montgomery coming up, but I like to see rookies work out of the pen for awhile before they start games.

    In general, I’m way against rushing prospects. What’s the point? They won’t help you compete, especially if you wait until you are buried in May. So all you are left with is risking your most valuable commodity to create some interest for a fan base that’s seen this dumb idea before.

    Get Kila up here if you want to bring up a hitter.

  • Sam

    Yeah…no.

    Triple A, maybe, but this is a team going nowhere soon, and rushing your top prospects (mightily) to languish on a last place club would be beyond nuts. Mous has a month of Double A going for him, and while he’s obviously been on a tear, it’s kind of silly to claim that an OK year of Single A and what could just be a hot month in AA is any kind of indication that he’s ready.

    Yeah, I get that Yost had some young guys learning on the job with Milwaukee, but this is too much too soon. Hell, if we brought him up at the start of NEXT year, we’d still be moving him very, very quickly.

    Rushing a prospect to the big leagues to keep the fans interested is what a really dumb organization would do. Fans are interested in winning. Moving a kid up before he’s given much indication that he might be ready is a good way to keep on cellar dwelling.

  • kief

    Are the skills there? Moose was a big disappointment last year, and i grew incresingly skeptical of the reports blaming that entirely on the ballpark at Wilmington. He had a brief flash in AZL, but it didn;t seem to last long. Has there been a change in his swing? Vision surgery? What info can you offer to convince us that one good month at NWA warrants a promotion to KC?

  • David Lesky

    JoakimTough

    In response to Callaspo needing to be moved, I think it’s Guillen who needs to be moved for this to happen. Callaspo can slide to the DH role that he’s perfect for and Moustakas can play third base.

    That said, I think it’s too soon. I’d really like to see him succeed in AA for at least half a season and get a little time in AAA before coming to the majors. I think the ideal situation is to keep in AA all season, give him a September callup and then let him start next year in AAA before coming up in June if he’s performing well.

  • Dan

    Absolutely bring up the hitters. There are no veterans blocking anyone. Butler is the only player that is not in jeopardy of losing his job.

    Be careful with the pitchers, but it is not like we don’t have places to put them.

    Bring Gordon back. Let Kila hit.

    As Marc Antony once remarked about the Royals, “Cry “Havoc!” and let slip the dogs of war,
    That this foul deed shall smell above the earth
    With carrion men, groaning for burial.”

  • Max

    I don’t see how it makes any kind of sense to bring him up this year. That would only signal to me that Dayton is panicking and is trying to save his job. He’s actually done a really good job of not rushing prospects and letting them prove themselves at each level. Moose has had 107 ABs above A ball – certainly not proof of any kind of mastery yet. I’d give him a full season in AA this year (unless its obvious he’s destroying the league, then maybe a promotion to AAA in August or so). Next spring, give him a chance to make the MLB club, but lean towards starting him in AAA to have him work his way to the club mid-season.

  • Deep Dixie Blue

    Moose is from the same draft as Heyward, so its not totally out of the question. Heyward seems to be handling it quite fine, too. Biggest reason is because of his maturity, which Moose seems to have also.

    Hard to see him jumping all the way to MLB right now with just a month of AA under his belt. And Alberto Callaspo needs to be moved first. But I wouldn’t mind at all seeing it. It would be a bold, bold move… it would also help explain the move of Gordon to OF.

    To the greater point, though, I would love to see the Royals start bringing up some younger players for the second half. If they don’t, a huge portion of the fanbase, including myself, is going to become totally disinterested with all the crap they’re running out there now (Guillen, Betancourt, Ankiel, I’m looking at you).

  • Ryan

    No way they should bring him up this season. I wouldn’t mind if he started with the Royals next season. We have veterans “blocking” Kila and Gordon. I would rather he come up next year (except maybe for a Sept call-up) with a line up and pitching staff of decent young players that have a chance to do something good. Moustakas should spend the latter half of the year if Omaha if they want to progress him.

  • JGSteeler

    I completely agree with you. I think that if these young guys have shown that they are mentally tough enough, then bring em up. If we are rebuilding this team and looking to the future, lets realize that we are not going to win this year and take a look at these young guys. Let them get Major league experience now when we can be patient with them and forgive their mistakes.

  • Greg Schaum

    Greg Schaum

    Also keep in mind that if Greinke is going to stay here…he needs to see something…He needs to see this process working before 2012…Because, by then it might be to late

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